TO INQUIRE INTO THE OCCUPATION OF LAND IN IRELAND.
965 to a neighbour from whom she took butter before to pay off the National Bank money.
I 10th Sept.,
1844.
1 could not call them farmers by this moans.
They are not farmers.
No man is a farmer but a man that can cultivate and manure Ms farm.
They want to skin the lands and burn them.
^0, They are hindered doing that, it being a mountainy place.
They are not allowed to burn Michael Sullivan.
those grounds, ancl that has discouraged them of late.
30.
Is not burning the land very injurious to the land?—Yes,
to some land—if there was a hare rock it would injure the land to burn it; if it was a mountain, it could not be properly brought to production without burning it.
Tho farmers in the same district, except one out 0f 100, cannot drink a pint of sour milk among five in family from about Christmas until about the 17th of March or so ; andthen generally they are forced to sell the sour milk in order to meet the rent, or pawn their clothes.
I 'know in different places three women in one house trusting to one cloak, and for a time perhaps it might be in the pawn-office.
31.
Of what class aro those women ?—They
work for farmers.
32.
What is the smallest quantity of land a man can support himself and his family out of at a moderate rent, by farming it and not having any other means of support ?—They
could, I know, where they are encouraged in that place, support themselves by ten acres, properly cultivated, of good light land, better than what they are doing by thirty acres, from the want of capital and means.
33.
Do many of the people of your class emigrate to America?—Not
many in the place, not in the very neighbourhood.
34.
Why do they not ?—The
most of them in that place are not able to emigrate from thc want of money.
35.
Supposing the means of emigration were given to them, would they be willing to emigrate?—They
are not anxious for it—they have not the courage; they are not so willing to emigrate.
36.
Those people you describe as being so wretched in their condition—supposing lands were supplied for them in America, would they be willing and anxious to emigrate ?—It
is hard for a man to account for another man's mind, but of course they would.
[The witness withdrew.]
Mr.
Thomas John Hungerford, sworn and examined.
72s!.
1.
Where do you reside?—Rosebank,
near Skibberecn.
I have been generally occupied
r' ' ' mseror '
as a land agent for tho last eighteen years.
2.
What is the district with which you are so well acquainted as to be able to give us information ?—The
immediate one wo are in, the Carbcrys; it is a very extensive one, including four baronies.
3.
Is it, generally speaking, a tillage district ?—Yes,
it is generally ; particularly along the sea coast every scrap that can bo tilled is tilled.
4.
Is the agriculture in it improving ?—Yes;
wo established an agricultural society here in 1836, to which I have been secretary, and it has made great progress, and would make more progress if the landlords gave that encouragement 1 think them bound to give, but which they are very tardy in doing ; and if such encouragement was held out in this district as is in others, the tenants would improve vastly.
5.
What encouragement do you suggest that landlords ought to give ?—Remuneration
for permanent improvements from year to year.
Without that tenants-at-will are very indif¬ ferent about improvements at all; and where landlords do not encourage them, they build the most wretched hovels, and are satisfied to live in them in that state.
6.
Can you state any system of encouragement given by the landlords in this district ?—
Yes; I know Mr.
Beecher allows for building new houses and draining and fencing, and I have known that productive of a very good effect.
Still a very general complaint exists that the price of land in the district is high.
7.
Have you had any means of comparing generally the letting value with the poor law valuation ?—Yes
; I have had a great number of opportunities, and as far as I could form any opinion, the letting, generally speaking, by the landlord is one-fifth over the poor law valuation.
8.
Do you consider the general letting too high ?—I
consider it high from my own know¬ ledge and experience generally, and especially from the state of cultivation the land is^in.
9.
Do you think it higher than in the other districts you are acquainted with ?—What
I see existing as an evil, exists in other districts in the county of Cork.
10.
Have you any suggestion you wish to lay before the commissioners as to the county rate ?—I
would suggest that the whole of the county rate should be paid by the landlord.
The landlord levies the rate and applies the rate, and derives the chief benefit of the expen¬ diture : he has a control over the grand jury in levying it.
Ancl also I think by that measure, we should get rid of a very heavy tax in tho way of baronial constables—they are paid a very large sum ; and if the landlords were obliged to pay the county rate there would be Tery little difficulty in collecting it, and the treasurer of the county would receive it through the bank.
11.
Have you any other point to suggest ?—With
regard to the poor rate, the general feeling of the peasantry is, that tho landlord ought to pay it.
Now comparing the valu¬ ation of the land under the poor law with the rent, I have found, in numberless instances, in settling with the tenants, that they paid no poor rate—it was all paid by the landlord.
!2.
What is your opinion of thc poor rate ?—I
think it a very fair one, takmg it as a whole.