Law and practice in respect to the occupation of land in Ireland: minutes of evidence: part II

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947 if I knew of any person giving SulHvan a bribe, and I said I was not privy to any thing of 9th September, 1844. 
the Mnd—that I knew nothing of it. 

Are you quite sure that what you are saying upon your oath, is the truth ?—Yes. 
711a 18. 
Why did you not toU Mr. 
Gallwey about it ?—I 
am quite certain it is the truth, and 

Cornelius Connor-I never told Mr. 
GaUwey a word about it. 

Why cHd you not tell Mr. 
GaUwey about it ?—I 
did not Hke to doit, as I was certain of my ground. 

[The ivitness withdrew.] 
Cornelius Henry Donovan, sworn and exammed. 
Where clo you Hve ?—In 
Where did you formerly reside ?—On 
the lands of Drumclough. 
How long did you hold those lands ?—About 
fifteen years. 
How did you lose those lands ?—There 
was a difference about the rent—£10. 
More rent was asked of you than you chose to give?—Yes, 
£10 more. 
Had you made any improvement upon those lands ?—A 
great deal. 
What improvements had you made ?—I 
had built a house there that cost over £200. 
Was any aUowanco made to you for that house ?—No. 
How were you put out ?—I 
overbold, and there were legal proceedings taken. 
Was any thing said to you, that if you gave up possession, any allowance shoidd be made ?—No, 
not a word. 
I sent respectable persons to interfere, and to say, that if I was not to havo the land, I hoped I should have some compensation ; and they have given £100 a piece to two persons who had land, but they would not give me a '-ftirthing. 

Had you built tMs house at tho time you were tenant to Lord Kenmare?—Yes. 
Had you any communication with Lord Kemnaro or Ms agent before you built tMs house ?—Yes, 
I had ; and he assured me that I should have my land at a reasonable rent, and that I should have a renewal on equitable terms, at tho expiration of the lease. 
You swear that that was said by Mr. 
When you wore first put out, did you remind Mm of what he had said ?—Yes. 
What was Ms answer?—That 
" By God!" 
he would not give me a shilling. 
Did he givo any reason for it ?—No, 
oidy that I had no claim, the Hfe being dead ; that if I had laid out £1,000, I had no claim. 
Was any rent owing when you were put out ?—No 
; ancl he would not take the rent from me. 
I sent the rent to Mm. 
Was SulHvan tho driver at the time when you wero put out?—He 
Had you any communication with Sullivan before you were put out?—Yes. 
What was it ?—1 
asked him one day had he much influence with his lordship or with Ms lordship's agent, Mr. 
lie said he had. 
" Do you tMnk there is any fear we shall not retain our holding ?" 
He said, " No, if the parties not residing upon the lands will not militate against your interest." 
Those were the two parties who got occu¬ pation, and there the conversation dropped. 
He came to me about a fortnight afterwards and asked me for a loan of £20. 
I told Mm I had not tho money to give him. 
"WeU," says lie, "you can raise it in the bank at Skibbereen." 
I said, " I have no objection to take it out of the bank for you." 
So we made an appointment to meet hi the way to the bank, and I went to tho bank and got the £20 by joining him in a note. 
This I thought was in the way of borrowing. 
Nothing occurred to me m the way of bribery at that time. 
I thought nothing of it at that time. 
When the bdl became due, he let it rim over for some days; but he went and paid the principal, finding I did not take it up. 
But he would not look me in the face after that when I met him. 
The way I learned it was, that I had to go to the bank to get some money for myself, and Mr. 
Clarke said, " There is another bill of yours;" I said, '* I am surprised at that," and he went over and showed me the biU. 
I remarked it was SuHivan's biU. 
He immediately said, *' But there is some 3s. 
or 4s. 
on it unpaid." 
Thinks I to myself, that is a hint; and I suspect, from that circumstance, if I had paid the money, I should not have been persecuted as I was. 
I have no proof; but that is the best of my beHef. 

[The witness withdrew.] 


7iZ» C. 

Skiebereen, Tuesday, 10th September, 1844. 
James M'Carthy, sworn and examined. 
Where do you reside ?—Goleen, 
in the west part of this county, near Crookhaven. 
What is your occupation ?—I 
hold some land as a middleman, wMch I let to others, and I hold some lands myself. 
What is the district with which you are so weU acquamted, as to be able to give us information ?—The 
district or parish of KUmore is about twelve to fourteen miles in length, and three or four in breadth; it is in general mountainous and rocky, but has some fertile lands here ancl there. 
The population was about 7,000 in 1S3L I suppose it must be increased since that time. 
Is the state of agriculture in it improvmg, or otherwise ?—I 
do not know that it is. 
As long as I recoUect, it has been in the very same state ; there is a very great population upon it, and there is not a bit of arable land that is not tilled. 
There is no decided improvement in the state of agriculture, principaHy owing to the landed proprietors givmg 

Part II. 
6 E 2 

See Mr. 

Evidence, f?A-

10th Sept., 

Mr, James M'Cartby.