964 EVIDENCE TAKEN BEFORE THE COMMISSIONERS APPOINTED 10th Sept.,
1844.
9.
Where do you generally go?—To
the lower part of this county.
I may work in the
rr"Z county of Tippcrary or Limerick.
Michael Sullivan
1Q' Is tLat at the bai'vest time ?—Yes'
J went out in h&^ time, and work in dio*mtt(, potatoes.
_
bb b 11.
What family havo you?—I
have five children.
12.
Are there seven of you to be supported?—Yes.
13.
What age is the eldest child ?—One
of them is twelve years the 6th of last May; the other nine, and so on.
14.
Are any of the children employed by farmers?—Not
one.
15.
How do you manage upon the 6d.
a day to support the family ?—My
landlord has a road making for the use of the farm, and has employed the tenants there, and I cannot deny but I have employment at the present hour, 16.
What is your general food for the family ?—NotMng
at all but dry potatoes.
17.
Have you fish?—Not
one, except they may bring a pen'orth home in a month; but it is not once in a month, or once in three months.
If my poor wife sells her eggs, or makes up a skein of thread, in thc market, she may take home with her a pen'orth or two pen'orth of something to nourish the children for that night; but in general, I do not use 5s.
of kitchen from one end of the year to the other, except what I may get at Christmas.
18.
Have you generally milk with your potatoes?—Not
a drop.
I have no means of gettmg it.
I would think myself middling happy if I could give the five children that; and if they were near a National School, I could give them schooling.
I have an idea of giving them schooling* as well as I ' an.
A better labouring man than what I am cannot afford his children any schooling, Liid even some of the people called farmers in the same place.
19.
Are there any free schools ?—Not
convenient to that place.
20.
Are you anxious that your cMldren should be taught to read and write?—Yes;
and so I am striving, but without the assistance of my good friends I could not do it.
21.
What docs your wife make by the week from her eggs ?—I
cannot give you the account of that.
She may make 2s.
6d.
or 3s.
now.
She may be the means of making up that.
That is not regulated as it ought.
The farmer has a corn field convenient, and we must keep the fowls from the corn field.
22.
Have you not a little garden attached to the house ?—Yes,
for 400 cabbages or so.
23.
Have you a pig ?—Yes.
24.
Have you a pig-bouse ?—No.
25.
Where is ho kept?—He
must bo kept in some part of the house, in a corner.
26.
Havo you any room for a pig-sty outside ?—No.
I might make room for the pig, if I was sure of the house for a second year, but I do not mean to go to the trouble; and many the same as me do not do so, not being sure of the houso for a second year.
27.
What bedsteads have you or ''bedding ?—I
have a chaff bed and bed-clothes that would do my own business, but I am in want of a second one.
I cannot afford to have it.
I cannot complain myself, but I could complain for others.
There are others of the poor working class, as I am myself, who have no beds, nor more than a gentleman or even a wealthy farmer would think too good for Ms pig, and they may He in the clothes they wear by the day.
28.
Can none of your children find employment among the farmers?—They
do not employ any of the children—not one ; and even we must go ourselves mto the country for the want of employment here: and I blame much the landlords of the country for that, though they are very indulgent.
I cannot but say that they are not fond of canting, or any thing of that kind: but still I know in my neighbourhood of the farmers paying £30 or £33 for a farm taken that is hardly worth £20, and then a cloud is hold over him by the arrears always, and he only gets a ticket, but no receipt—he would not have that, as far as I under¬ stand the case.
The landlord ought to be to the farmer or to the tenant much the same as a father to a son, to give him his ground for tho value; and then the tenant can act for the landlord as well as a son for a father.
That is not the case.
Then there are the agents and the drivers worse than that again.
I do not blame the head landlords, for there are many things doing that they know notMng at all about.
The rent is too high; and as I am on my oath, I am confident that numbers who leave the country for want of employment, could be employed in their own country for fifteen years, on one lot of waste ground that could be brought to production—some of it better than the best of the ground for general crops; if it was brought to production, and drained and fenced, it would grow potatoes and oats as well as the land now used ; and when the lawful rent is taken for that farm by the landlord, the rent is over that.
If it was let for the value, they could employ men, and give the labouring man his work, if they got encouragement from the landlord.
29.
What sort of encouragement ?—I
am no great author upon matters of this kind, but I will givo my opinion.
The" encouragement I would wish to have between them is, suppose a farm is worth £20, it is not worth that altogether, being impoverished, as it is; but if it was worth £20, if brought to production, I would compel the tenant to use a part of it for the improvement of the land for a few years, and then, when the ground would be worth the rent, to have the landlord come and take the £20 a year for it, and then the tenant could pay that independently after a time.
But for want of capital, how can a man do that, when more than the lawful rent is taken from the poor man ?
I knew an instance of a man who was a stout farmer once, who asked a woman, who was churning three pounds of butter, to let him have it, and he would give her a ticket to account for it.
She refused, and said she could not.
She came to Mm afterwards with an excuse, and said, she was obHged, to give it
